Posts by Island Man

It's my speculation that they could possibly issue new light saying it's impossible to know exactly when Satan was cast out of heaven. They might say that we only know Jesus was enthroned in October 1914 but we can't know exactly how long after this (in human chronological terms) he was cast out, because humans perceive time differently to spirit creatures in heaven and what could seem to Satan and Michael like a battle of a few hours. could be experienced as months or years on the human time scale.

Perhaps they will say that WWI approximately coincides with the war in heaven between Michael and Satan and that the heavenly war perhaps explains the outbreak of WWI - Satan was so preoccupied with Jesus imminent enthronement and the heavenly battle that immediately ensued that he was too busy to effectively oversee his earthly kingdom, resulting in a temporary state of global turmoil that we know as WWI.

They will say that they love this new teacing and that it makes sense because WWI started in late July while Jesus was clearly enthroned in October, therefore WWI clearly could not have been the result of Satan's ouster since he was ousted soon after Jesus' enthronement - on or after October, and not late July when WWI actually started.

Whatever the case, the fact that they put Satan's ouster as "about 1914" clearly indicates that a new light bulb is about to be unveiled by GB 2.0.

32

It came in today's mail

by Virgochik in

it came today, the dreaded envelope containing my personal copy of "return to jehovah" from my elderly, desperate mother.

it included a small note asking me to read it over and to let her know what i think.

she got it at her assembly.. firstly, i'm angry that she continues to push her religion on me, given that i stopped attending meetings over thirty years ago, and very offended that she assumes that i still want to be a witness, which is her choice of religion, not mine.

Island Man

Whenever you speak to your Mother, discuss anything besides religion. Redirect the conversation to

family life

Virgochick: So how's aunt X doing?

Virgochick's Mom: She is having a tough time with her two boys. They are so rebellious. You know, if only she took the Truth seriously all those problems could have been avoided. Jehovah's organization has given us so many wonderful publications to improve our family life. When we do things Jehovah's way it always turns out well for us. But when we don't . . .

tv shows

Virgochick: So Mom, have you been watching any interesting TV shows lately?

Virgochick's Mom: Oh yes. I've been looking at the best TV shows out there - the shows on JW broadcasting. Do you know the society now has its own tv channel? They have wonderful monthly programs hosted by a member of the Governing Body. They are so very encouraging! Have you seen them? You should go to jw.org and you'll see a link on there somewhere, I don't know exactly how to get to it - but I watch them at the kingdom hall every month.

movies

Virgochick: Seen any good movies?

Virgochick's Mom: Yes, I recently saw 'Return of the prodigal son'. That was such a wonderful movie. That was produced by the society, you know. Can you imagine, Virgochick, they're now making movies! Jehovah's chariot is certainly moving ahead! Those not with the chariot are certainly missing out on a lot . . .

books

Virgochick: Read any good books?

Virgochick's Mom: But of course, sweetie. You of all persons should know that Jehovah's Witnesses are the reading-est people on the planet! What with all the magazines and other publications the society provides for our spiritual nourishment on a regular basis. A good one I read recently is called 'Return to Jehovah'. I'll be sure to mail you a copy . . .

politics

Virgochick: what do you think of Hilary Clinton's chances of winning in 2016?

Virgochick's Mom: Whether she wins or loses matters not to me. All I know is that God's Kingdom is the only hope to solve man's problems and no system of government - be it autocracy, democracy, communism, socialism, sharia law, ISIS or feminocracy - can ever solve man's problems!

world events, news

Virgochick: What do you think about what ISIS is doing in the middle east?

Virgochick's Mom: Oh they're terrible! Slaughtering men women and children, fomenting warfare - and they have the gall to claim they're doing God's will! Can you imagine Jehovah ever instructing his worshipers to commit such horrible atrocities? But what do you expect from Babylon the Great! Those evil people are proof positive that we must be living deep in the time of the end. It is inconceivable that Jehovah will allow this evil system to go on much longer. You really need to return to Jehovah, Virgochick, while there is still time . . .

jokes games, entertainment, gossip, music, work, exercise, health... Whatever you would talk about with a Non-JW friend.

Virgochick: Wow Mom, look how late it is already! My how time flies! It's been so nice talking to you but I must leave now . . .

Virgochick's Mom: But Sweety, we haven't yet talked about jokes, games, gossip, music, work, exercise, health . . . whatever you would talk about with your non-JW friends . . .

18

John 21:23 a new argument for JW's regarding false prophecy promoted being OK

by ILoveTTATT2 in

jw
friends

i want as many minds put into this as possible.. there is a new argument among the extreme jw apologists, saying that even the disciples promoted mistakes.

they base themselves on john 21:23. keep in mind, i am not a believer but i want the answer from a believer's standpoint, please.. .

nwt:.

Island Man

I agree with the refutative points you made near the end of your OP. One other point I would add is that this error started before christians were anointed with holy spirit - the "spirit of the truth" - which Jesus said will guide them into all the truth. In contrast, Watchtower errors have always been promulgated by Watchtower leaders professing to be anointed with holy spirit. So Watchtower's comparison of its own errors with that of John 21:23 is not valid.

57

Are atheists more likely to be morally good than Christians?

by FusionTheism in

i have no problem saying atheists and christians are equal.. but some people seem to have the belief that atheists are more likely to be morally good, or more likely to change the world for good, than christians and theists.. but what evidence do you have to support this claim?.

if atheism is what causes people to do great positive things for the world, then why weren't martin luther king, jr., william wilberforce, isaac newton, francis collins, barack obama, mother theresa, abraham lincoln, or john f. kennedy atheists?.

Island Man

Yes, and here's why:

1. Christianity teaches some immoral tenets which christians are duty bound to accept in the name of "trusting in the Lord/Jehovah with all your heart and not leaning on your own understanding". Christian morality is rooted in the concept of unquestioning obedience to authority of scripture. Whatever scripture says has to be accepted as right even if the conscience chafes at it. Christians will often justify following immoral tenets that are counter-intuitive to the conscience by saying something along the lines of man being sinful and/or limited in understanding so we should not put too much stock in our own moral sense, i.e. just because shunning seems cruel doesn't mean its not the right thing to do. God knows better than our fallen, imperfect consciences.

Atheists, however, are free to follow their conscience and don't have to engage in immoral behavior that is counter-intuitive to the conscience. Atheists don't have to jump through hoops to defend the bible's immoral position of condoning slavery.

2. Christianity attracts lots of sycophants. Because christianity holds out the reward of everlasting life if you're good and eternal destruction or torment if you're bad, many christians are not good for goodness sake. They're only good to get a reward and avoid a punishment. By contrast, atheists are good with pure motives. They like doing the right thing. They're not doing the right thing to gain an eternal reward or avert their destruction. Unlike the morally clueless JWs who return lost money to create an opportunity to shamelessly plug their religion, an atheist would return lost money because he genuinely cared about the owner - not because he's thinking of plugging an ideology.or religion.

87

Disturbing hidden image in w15 04/15 page 9 (Not DF image)

by campaign of hate in

could someone do me a favor and post the picture on page 9 on the above mentioned watchtower.. i'll point it out, very surprised no one else has picked up on this creepy image..

Island Man

"I can buy the disgruntled/bored artists idea, but beyond that I can't see what the point would be.
Unless someone can propose a scientific answer as to why the WT would put in images of a bloke lying on the ground?"

Exactly! It makes no sense whatsoever when you spend a little time to think about it. It only makes sense to the Subliminal Image Conspiracy Kook Oriented.

87

Disturbing hidden image in w15 04/15 page 9 (Not DF image)

by campaign of hate in

could someone do me a favor and post the picture on page 9 on the above mentioned watchtower.. i'll point it out, very surprised no one else has picked up on this creepy image..

Island Man

"Your picture illustrates my point. We have a photograph of a wave and if we use our imagination, we can see a shape that resembles a face. This is a totally different situation from a hand or computer drawn image in which a face is intentionally inserted."

The photograph of the wave proves that pareidolia effects can happen naturally and be missed by many until it is pointed out to them by an astute observer. Now combine this with the fact that Watchtower often creates its illustrations by using live models on a set, which the artist makes a likeness of. So if there happens to be a live set with a pareidolia effect which the artist is oblivious to, wouldn't he capture it in the image unwittingly? Just as many people can miss these so called subliminal images it is very plausible that the artists also unwittingly create them without noticing. So the argument about the artist knowing every stroke proves nothing. He can know every stroke and still be oblivious to the "subliminal image" - the pareidolia effect - that he unwittingly creates.

Look at it another way: What if the photograph posted by Africanman was the model used by a Watchtower artist to create an illustration, and as a result the illustration came out appearing to have a face? All the Watchtower subliminal image conspiracists would be hopping up and down about Watchtower inserting the subliminal image of a face in the illustration when, in actuality, the face was inserted by nature in the real world and the artist just did a very good likeness of the photograph and missed the effect.

24

Why are Battle Against Faith

by Jonathan Drake in

if any are willing, share your fact based reasons for viewing faith as dangerous.

viewing faith as dangerous is the reason for almost all of my posts recently.

what seems constant is that theists are too focused on there own little world to realize how and why faith is so damaging to society.

Island Man

Why battle against faith?

"By faith Abraham, when he was tested, as good as offered up Isaac, and the man that had gladly received the promises attempted to offer up [his] only-begotten [son]," - Hebrews 11:17

As the above text clearly shows, faith can be a very dangerous thing.

Religious people use faith to deny facts, logic, reason and even their basic built-in conscience. Isn't faith the underlying reason why JWs let themselves and their children die rather than accepting lifesaving blood transfusions? Isn't faith the underlying reason why a JW will fight his basic humanity by shunning his own flesh and blood over a changed religious opinion?

A world with religious zealots who value faith above what is demonstrably true and above the basic proddings of conscience, can be a very dangerous place! Even the bible unwittingly acknowledges this:

"In fact, the hour is coming when everyone that kills YOU will imagine he has rendered a sacred service to God" - John 16:2

87

Disturbing hidden image in w15 04/15 page 9 (Not DF image)

by campaign of hate in

could someone do me a favor and post the picture on page 9 on the above mentioned watchtower.. i'll point it out, very surprised no one else has picked up on this creepy image..

Island Man

Of all the ills that can be pointed out about Watchtower literature, the whole subliminal images conspiracy woo is just scraping the bottom of the barrel. No, to be fair, it's worse than scraping the bottom of the barrel! It's delusional, pseudo-scientific, conspiracy-theorist, wack-job, lunacy!

For the umpteenth time, it's nothing but pareidolia, people! Stop fitting yourself into Watchtower's stereotype of "mentally diseased"!